A dilemma

[Dominum]

1: You will need an M170 to get the FPS you want.
2: Even reinforced V2s are prone to cracking once you go over an M150, so if you use an AR buy an STS and a metal bodied gun.
3: If you go with the AR, buy something with a nice metal body. The internals won't matter a bit since you will be gutting them anyway.
4: If you go the M14 route, do not buy anything other than a CA or a G&G due to their considerably higher parts compatibility. Buying a true V7 is asking for a headache and will cost more money.
5: As was said, inner barrel length is not a big deal, and lasers and flashlights on that wouldn't do any good.
6: V7 shells are inherently stronger than V2 shells.
7: The parts that will be needed: Metal guide rod, metal piston head, metal cylinder head, half tooth piston w/steel or titanium teeth, M170, 1:15 helical gear set, metal bushings or ball bearings (I have heard of ball bearings failing under duress, but have not once seen it happen in a gun in SC except due to user error. So, I would try them and if they fail use metal bushings, otherwise use metal bushings but understand you will have a high friction coefficient), custom wiring w/MOSFET, very high torque motor with a quality pinion gear. You will want ball bearings on one of the two (either piston head or spring guide), but not both as it will not leave enough space for the spring to fully compress and thus the GB would not cycle. Having rarely worked with M170s (obviously), you may in fact not be able to put them on either end. However, since it will be running in semi anyway they are not crucial.

The new M14s aren't as bad to break down as the old true V7s were, not that they're a piece of cake mind you.

[VoidSuicide]

Alright, I'm planning to get the G+G.And your parts list is going to be very helpful.

Also, what price would I be looking at to get a box set of g+g compatable m14 110 round midcap mags?

[Star_folder]

Well, I guess I'll give you a build list for the G&G M14.

• -You will need a very powerful spring, at least an M170, possibly an M180. Personally, i would pick up a Gaurder SP170.
  
  -Piston, I would go with an SHS piston, pretty much any of them will do, they are all very strong and will keep your build up and running for a long time.
  
  -The Piston head should be polycarb. I have a Modify Polycarb Piston head in my L85 and it is still holding strong under the Modify S170 I have in there. But the polycarb will absorb shock more so than a metal piston head will, thus relieving extra stress from the gearbox shell. Same thing with the piston, polycarb piston will absorb more shock and won't be as hard on the gearbox shell. Polycarb teeth are fine, as long as the AoE is correct, it will be fine.
  
  -Gears. I've got two ideas when it comes to gears. Either go cheap and replaceable, or go expensive and never worry about it. SHS gears are very strong, and very cheap, if they break, oh well, there goes $20. Or, get some Siegetek Gears (RiotSC's gearset), they are the closest you can get to indestructible, and RiotSC offer's a lifetime warranty on them, so if they ever break, you can easily get a replacement. It's up to you, but Riot's gears are $100+ There is also no need for helicals or even super torque gears, I'm running standard torque in my L85 without a problem. Torque up gears will slow your trigger response, but will relieve stress from your motor and the gears themselves, so it's up to you on that matter.
  
  -I highly suggest bushings. While Dom may not have seen bearings fail in SC, I doubt many people have pushed their guns as far as you want to here in SC. Other parts of the world people have been crazy for a long time, and found bearings to reliably fail at high fps levels. I wouldn't risk it. Modify makes some fantastic Steel bushings.
  
  -Mosfets are up to you, steevo makes good mosfets, as does Extreme-fire, and AWS, though the latter are more known for their specialized mosfets that come with many special features. I use an extreme-fire mosfet in my L85 to lock out full auto. The important part is that it protects your trigger contacts from the constant semi auto.
  
  -Motors. I've heard fantastic reports about the SHS motors, and the JG Blue motor, however I have little to no experience with either motors. I do know that G&P Makes some fantastic motors, and though they are more expensive, they have much better quality control. I personally use a G&P M170 in my L85. I also want to state that I'm using the stock "soft" G&P Pinion gear, and it is holding up fine. Just be sure you set the motor height really well before you put the spring in your gearbox.
  
  -I believe you will need a metal spring guide, iirc, the stock G&G one is plastic. I don't believe having ball bearings on both the spring guide and the piston head is a problem, but I don't know for sure, as the L85 has an extended piston unlike most AEGs. However, the piston head I suggested above has ball bearings. Another point is that I've had spring guide ball bearings fail at high fps, as the spring wrapped around them, which locked up the gearbox. I don't remember if the Spring guide is a v2 or a v3 type, though which ever spring guide you get, try to get one that does not screw into the back. Having a spring guide you can stick a screw driver into will help TREMENDOUSLY with such a heavy spring.

Those are what I can think of that you will need to pull this spring reliably. But you'll still have lots of DIY mods that need to be done to get the most out of your rifle, especially shimming, motor height, and AoE correction. And that doesn't begin to cover any accuracy upgrades or modifications.

[Dominum]

I'll have to disagree on the polycarb teeth and piston head. While I know Modify makes great stuff (why do you think I carry so much Modify at SCAirsoftSupply.com ) I have seen too many high quality polycarb pistons and piston teeth fail even when properly installed and correctly paired with compatible parts. I'm not disputing the great performance you have seen from them, but I would rather play it safe then sorry. I don't think he has to worry about the shell cracking. Higher torque gears will put considerably less stress on the electrical components and motor, and with everything I suggest you can still get excellent trigger response. I have an M16 DMR with all the parts I listed (for the most part) and it has excellent trigger response but is not over working it's motor, wiring, or battery. I understand that some people are hesitant about steel teeth on their pistons because they are afraid it will ruin their gearset, but the only time I have ever seen that be a problem is when someone does something they shouldn't be doing. All that being said, this is a matter of opinion and there isn't an empirical right or wrong here.

[Star_folder]

hahaha, yeah, I kind of figured you would disagree. The world would be a boring place if we didn't have our own opinions. But I agree, you do it your way, I'll do it mine. You've been doing this for much longer than I have.

[Dominum]

One of the sometimes great but usually awful thing about airsoft is that it is often very inconsistent, likely because there are so many small parts involved made by so many different companies. I have seen so many things that make no sense when cross referenced with other guns of the same make or with the same parts it's crazy. There is a lot of luck involved LOL.

[Skywalker]

if you want a true sniper, and not another dmr, IMO, it needs to be a gun that is semi auto by nature, such as SR-25, SVD, ........or PSG-1 ;P

I know where you can get a G&G SR-25 pre upgraded for about 400. It'd probably prefer being in your hands than in the closet at killers place lol. ... I know you're out there lurking

[Skywalker]

As for parts, i've made bearings fail, stick with bushings. I swear by deep fire titanium tooth pistons, they are incredible. Sorbo solves alot, also I would go with some torque up gears. If you get a good motor you don't need much of a torque up, but if you're replacing the gears, you might as well.

Have you built a gun that uses a m140 or m150 spring before? Because there is a big difference between that and a m170; not only the perfection of your workmanship, but, expect the gun to spend more time on the workbench than in the field. Its just the nature of the beast.

[VoidSuicide]

I would somewhat agree, but I really want the m14 style, not to mention the sr-25 is about what my m16 built would've been, only with less barrel-past-ris on the m16. But theres probably a way I could set it up to be semi only, thus removing the possibility of accidentally bumping the gun into full auto.

And then no, I have yet to do any builds really, but this project is still sitting a bit down the road. With this thread I'm mostly trying to find what depth I'd be jumping into beforehand, instead of jumping into a big can of pain in the neck and wallet.

[Skywalker]

Oh yeah you can make a m14 semi no problem. Im just saying, for it to be a sniper rifle, it should be a gun that doesn't shoot full auto in real life. IMO.

And no, by all means, jump in. Its the best way to learn. As long as you have the money time and patience for it

[Dominum]

What situations have you had bearing fail in, and what kind were they? I have had Systema 7mm bearings last for thousands of rounfs on an M150, and they even survived an M170 for a bit. I don't doubt you of course, I am just trying to get a better feel for their failure circumstances because I never get to see it (but that's a good thing I guess LOL).

[Skywalker]

Well the dsg build did it no problem lol. ... I do believe i've blown out another set of them on a more normal build, but yes, now that I think about it, they were both stock echo1 with tons of miles on them. Miles=rounds

[Dominum]

The reason I asked is because I often hear of people saying not to use bearings because they fail, and they often assume their failure to be due to simply being in too high FPS or ROF of a build. Based on my experience, I have always thought it to be much more likely that it was due to either cheap parts, improper installation, excess debris and lack of lube, or simply a part that has simply seen too much wear and tear. I always use bearings in everything, and have yet to have a problem. Granted I am sure they will go out eventually, but no sooner than bushings IMO IF all of the above is avoided, in fact they should last longer. My hypothesis would have been incorrect had you said they were brand new high end ones, as you would have installed them properly I'm sure and their failure cause would have had to have been simply not being able to handle the workload demanded. Seeing as they were stock E1 and very well used this hypothesis may still prove true. I have two builds coming up soon that should test it further, so I will let you know (if you are as interested as I am in it that is).

[Skywalker]

Haha. I guess my biggest thing to it is... what's the real advantage?

[Star_folder]

I'm interested in a bearing stress test. I've also heard that they die easily. Frankly, I kind of feel like they would, regardless, I've got bushings in all my guns because I can't find any reason they would ever fail for any reason. Solid chunks of steel are kind of hard to bend or break.