OP Black Thorn

[GARRETT]

Refs are not a necessary thing. But knowing you will be ejected from the game with no refund is. AOSC games do not have refs, but do have admin, and in game reps who can disolve problems rather quickly. Maybe next time have your team help run the game as our reps do. As for the trouble makers, I would like to know who they were so they can be watched at our games. Please PM me the names if you would. Good luck in the future with the games.

[SteevoLS]

I think it should be pointed out that AOSC games almost never have refs, and we rarely have any severe issues with hitcalling. If you're a low-down slimeball of a player, the presence of referees will only make you think twice... you're still going to cheat. Fortunately, we can weed those players out.

Edit: Annnnd Garrett beat me to the punch.

[Esteban]

It felt more like a scrimmage instead of an OP, but I still had a good deal of shooting and some fun.  

PROS:
Respawn points weren't a large trek away; gets you back into the action sooner.
The bunkers were pretty fun playing in and around. Cheap lunch! Perfect weather! The field wasn't far from the parking lot.

CONS:
First game I didn't know what I was looking for with the missiles (I didn't know what they looked like)
There was little to no action in the woods away from that killing field. I feel like it could have been used more. I didn't like the entrance to the field as my car doesn't have much ground clearance..

[Nytestalker]

First I would like to thank Raven Recon for putting on this game.
Pros
-Nice to meet new faces on field.
-Field that was just right for the amount of people.
Cons
-Unsportsman like conduct on both sides
-Horrible placement of respawn points.  Because of the fields shape the respawn areas need to be on the outer corners of the field instead of in the field.
-Confusion about what some of the objectives were.  It wasn't made clear where we were suppose to go in the second game which caused some problems.
-No Chrono so noone can really say that they were with in there MED.
-No MED rules.
-Everyone not having dead rags.  They cost 1$ and I always carry extra with me.
On a personal note, as the Coordinator of Team USA I hold all my players to a high standard and cheating will not be tolerated.  If anyone has any legitimate problems with anyone on my team then you should come and find me and it will be addressed.  If you don't then nothing can be done.  Also you might as well write everyone's name that was there on your "troublemaker" list.  For one thing you were not there to assess what was going on.  There were problems from both sides of the player field and the host of the game.  Doing so will only bring unjustified scrutiny on players who honestly didn't do anything.  If anyone has anything that they need to say personally then PM me and I will gladly give you my number.
Nytestalker-Coordinator
Team USA

[Vesper]

-Horrible placement of respawn points.  Because of the fields shape the respawn areas need to be on the outer corners of the field instead of in the field.

Agreed.

[Dominum]

Ditto to Steevo and Garrett, Refs are not nearly as effective as a system of embedded Reps. Also, whoever runs the game is the person ultimately responsible for behavior of players, and not being afraid to kick people out for intentional rule violations is the only way to deter others from doing so. Once they know that they will actually be held accountable, not just told they will be, players are more apt to comply.

[Doublewolf]

Ditto to Steevo and Garrett, Refs are not nearly as effective as a system of embedded Reps. Also, whoever runs the game is the person ultimately responsible for behavior of players, and not being afraid to kick people out for intentional rule violations is the only way to deter others from doing so. Once they know that they will actually be held accountable, not just told they will be, players are more apt to comply.

It would be nice to have at least one rep not on a team, though, to be completely unbiased that had the final say. Playing reps aren't always easily accessible to resolve issues or answer questions, and although not on purpose, playing reps can sometimes be slightly biased towards their team.

I do agree, though. I've never seen people cheat, except new players who don't understand the rules, and none of the games I've been to have had "refs".

[Dialed_In]

I would like to thank Raven Recon for hosting this event , and the follow- up call about my eye ( not an airsoft injury) .

I would like to say that it was a nice change that the game started on time and appeared to be organized. I agree there should have been some attempt at chrono simply for safety, especially with people who are sniping. The boundaries on the field were not clearly defined by players who had never been on that field.

As for not calling hits..... It seems that this is a chronic problem at every game, AOSC or non AOSC alike.
If there is anything airsoft players hate it's cheaters. Cheaters are usually also the first on the field to start yelling "I HIT YOU! I HIT YOU!" Think about this, you can see when you're hitting someone. What makes you think we cannot see when you get hit? When you cheat nobody ever thinks "Wow that guy is good, he didn't get shot."
Instead everyone thinks you're a jerk.

This game is about honor, for those of us who have actually served in the arm service we appreciate this. I was a witness albeit one eyed to a player with an obvious deadrag walking off the field and continuously getting barraged by BB's, when he said Im hit knock it off, the opposing player said do I don't give s shit, ironically that individual was boating about it at the parking lot.

Vesper, Esteban and Chris good seeing you guys out there ....

[Esteban]

Hey man. I hope your eye is doing better. Check out the game pictures because I snapped a good one of you.

[Dominum]

It would be nice to have at least one rep not on a team, though, to be completely unbiased that had the final say. Playing reps aren't always easily accessible to resolve issues or answer questions, and although not on purpose, playing reps can sometimes be slightly biased towards their team.

I do agree, though. I've never seen people cheat, except new players who don't understand the rules, and none of the games I've been to have had "refs".

At most large games the Admin does not play DW, and non-playing Rep would, by the same logic, be no less biased by not playing as his/her team and friends would still be playing, so I do not see how that would help. As far as availability, the Admin is always on channell one at AOSC games and I have never, and do not beleive any of the other Reps have ever, refused to resolve something because they were too busy playing either. As far as bias towards one's team or faction, we haven't had any problems with that, in fact most of the times a Ref has to point out the rules it is to someone on their own faction because that's who they see more of. When Reps have to resolve an issue, it is much more often detrimental to their faction as they have to take themselves out of the game for however long it takes and thus are not playing. However, if you do know of any incident where you believe a Rep was acting in a biased manner, you should report it to another Rep. That can not be allowed to continue.

[berbinator]

@Dominum

I was the one who got hit with a red dead rag tied to my gun.  To be perfectly honest I don't know who shot Vesper and me as I (thankfully) had my back turned when we were hosed down.  However, as Team USA comprised the bulk of Bravo I would say that is statistically probable

@Bravo

Regardless of who did what to whom I owe an apology to the opposition for a poor attitude later in the game and afterward.  Lashing out at an abuse only aggravated the situation.  While we may not be able to control our circumstances we can certainly attempt to govern our attitudes.  I also want to commend the one bravo player, sadly I can't remember his name for being an excellent sport and actively reaching out in conciliation to both sides. Props to you.